Author Topic: Tilemap with polyvector strips  (Read 6112 times)

Offline Leginus

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #15 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
Thats good to know with the RND. thanks

Offline Wampus

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #16 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
For my part I've just come to accept that anything 3GS upwards I can expect an average 60FPS unless I'm doing something very CPU intensive. For 3G and below its better, in my estimation, to cap the refresh at 30FPS because even the slowest iDevices I've tested on can manage that for the routines I've been using.

As I see it GLBasic isn't best suited to graphically fast & intense games on older iPhones/iPods. The biggest advantage of GLBasic is cross-compatibility and quick development time for whatever you create, which is very significant thing. If you want highly efficient code and fast rendering you'd do better going native but then you lose the flexibility and easiness of something like GLBasic.

Offline Ian Price

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #17 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
Quote
For my part I've just come to accept that anything 3GS upwards I can expect an average 60FPS unless I'm doing something very CPU intensive.
Never assume anything. I've seen my iPod struggling to do things that my supposedly less powerful GP2X can do with ease. It's about manipulating the code so that it fits the machine - there's usually ways to achieve the same results, but they often take longer to get to them. I've been constantly surprised about how poor the iPhone really is in terms of real raw power.
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Offline Dark Schneider

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #18 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
Quote
32px tiles = 150 tiles on screen :  58 fps
You should not use smaller ones, that is the size 32-bit consoles (Saturn, PSX) uses for 2D games.

Quote
Sure, but when I'll add four or five animated sprites and the frame rate will go below 30 fps, it'll be the same problem.
I can assure you that below 30 fps never happens, I have drawn some tile layers with animated sprites, and NEVER goes below 30 fps. The 30 fps limit gives us fresh air, for that is much used in these small devices.

Let's do one benchmark, draw the layer twice, the same layer, I mean, when you draw with the 6 POLYVECTORs, do it inside a:
Code: (glbasic) [Select]
for i%=0 to 1
   //6 POLYVECTORs calls
next

This doesn't consume CPU, because those vertices are in cache, and iPhone is able to handle more than those vertices by far, but this can help to detect if it is problem of GPU (pixel rate). If you get lower FPS, it can be because some reasons:

- GPU pixel rate: think that in those games made with the iPhone SDK, uses a front-to-back drawing way, for that I asked for it if was possible http://www.glbasic.com/forum/index.php?topic=4665.0, using z-buffer those games draws only 1 time the pixel of the screen.

- CPU: because GLBasic compiles in a generic way, using the GCC, and maybe for each POLYVECTORs group or inside the generating OpenGL VBO, many OpenGL commands are inserted, and you know, API calls are CPU expensive, but this is the price for using an upper programming layer, in the other hand, you have portable code (compiles for many platforms) and is much easier to use (faster game creation).

Besides, many of the more important games on iPhone (Angry Birds) runs at 30 FPS and people is not "angry" for that.

Offline TomG

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #19 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
Besides, many of the more important games on iPhone (Angry Birds) runs at 30 FPS and people is not "angry" for that.
I lol'd =D

BTW, the very small tilesize was just for fun.

Well then, I think I get it. I guess this topic is solved, thanks for the answers !

Offline Hatonastick

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #20 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
I've been constantly surprised about how poor the iPhone really is in terms of real raw power.

Don't let Steve Jobs hear you say that, he may send his highly trained "iHit Squad 2.0" after you!
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Offline Leginus

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #21 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
 =D

Offline Ian Price

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #22 on: 2011-Jan-16 »
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Don't let Steve Jobs hear you say that, he may send his highly trained "iHit Squad 2.0" after you!
Steve Jobs already knows how poor (power-wise) the iPhone is. And he's laughing all the way to the bank. Don;t get me wrong, it's a lovely machine with a nice OS, but it seriously lacks oomph. And by the sounds of things, so does the iPad. But I'm not a rich git and can't comment on that from personal experience! :P
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Offline doimus

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #23 on: 2011-Jan-18 »
iPhone is certainly powerful enough. Much more powerful than other gaming handhelds anyway. Problem is, other handhelds (PSP, DS) have hardware accelerated 2D graphics, while iPhone does not.

But there has to be a workaround for this, as there are many tile-based games on iPhone.
One possible solution would be to design the map as one 3d object and use UV map for tile placement. That way, the entire map would be drawn in one draw-call, I guess.



Offline Kitty Hello

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #24 on: 2011-Jan-19 »
Yes. many 2D engines use the 2D core to make stuff and then upload the final image as one texture and draw one quad.

Is it really that slow? I mean, with polyvector I've been able to draw quite some stuff. Especially on the newer devices.

Offline Leginus

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #25 on: 2011-Jan-19 »
Not had any problems myself yet.  I suppose I have just jinxed myself  :x

Offline Wampus

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Re: Tilemap with polyvector strips
« Reply #26 on: 2011-Jan-19 »
A while ago I wrote a little app to test how much my 3GS would cope with tiling sprites of different sizes from 160 x 160 to 20 x 20. You can change how many are shown on screen, their scaling, etc. If its any use to anyone, for instance TomG you might find it interesting how the different draw methods and alphamodes compare on a 2G phone, then I've attached it to this post.

If you use it then its a better measure of speed if you take out the slow background drawing from 109 to 111:-

ALPHAMODE 0

DRAWSPRITE 5, 0, 0

[attachment deleted by admin]