Hello. I'm new to this forum but I was looking for a partner with game development knowledge and programming skills for the iPad/iPhone that would be looking to profit share and have fun on a side project. Later on, I suppose it has potential to be ported to other OS. I figured this was a good place to ask as I was reading up on GLBasic.
I have a somewhat simple idea that I would like to become a game. I can create the images, maps, concepts, and 3d models (in a program such as 3D Studio Max.) I'm pretty much just looking for a side scroller type of game that has collisions and can tilt. However, I lack the programming skills to make the game actually happen/interact.
You can check out my 3d work at my website so that you know I am serious about my 3D work: http://www.lunarstudio.com/ (http://www.lunarstudio.com/)
If you are interested and serious, please email me with a link to a portfolio of projects that you have worked on:
cleo@lunarstudio.com
Thank you,
Chuck
If this isn't some sort of spam (we've had a lot of it lately pretending to be legitimately interested in GLB and yet more interested in posting a link to an external website and any posts like yours with a single post count is suspicious), you might want to whack together some game type objects, eg. a spaceship or similar, as it's likely to be a better example of what you can do regarding game related artwork -- there's just a bit of a difference between the two is all I'm saying. Not unless your game involves flying chairs, tables and ovens.
I await your (non) reply to determine whether or not you are legitimate. Not that I'm interested in helping either way. My bet is you are spam. =D
Whilst I suspect that HOAS is indeed correct, I would like to be proved wrong. And like him, would love to see some game related media to show that you are really interested in game deelopment and not just a spammer.
Email him to make some $$$ appstore games?
Understandable. I am very serious. I wouldn't have more than one post count here simply because I am not much of a programmer (HTML, CSS, old school ActionScript, and some PHP if you actually count those...) I'm a little disappointed in what I perceive as slight hostility to a newcomer to this forum that's trying to actually make something happen.
The reason why I got into 3D to begin with was because I love gaming. Only reason I focus on architecture is that it sort of pays the bills. And I'm not going to "whack together" something in my off-time (trust me, you get burnt out doing 3D after 8+ years - especially considering the economy, interior design, and architecture) - would rather spend little time I have with my GF or playing SC2/WoW. I think my website shows my skills as-is and if you can't see the potential or that I know what I am doing, then there's no point in trying to impress. The Apple platform opens up a lot of possibilities for game artists and developers to collaborate on a more independent basis. I've been wanting to create a game for it since the first phone was released.
My main issue is that I can do 3D, concepts, websites, and the graphics - I just can't "assemble" the game itself into a cohesive working piece. Fortunately/unfortunately, I kind of need a good partner to hold my hand there a little. As for finding that right partner to make that happen, that's going to be the trick. I have a few friends that say they can do something - but I'm quite skeptical to be honest. I'm not entirely sure if the GLBasic website/forum is a good place to look. I saw a few impressive screenshots on the iPhone announcement section and that's why I thought this might be a good starting point.
The type of quality game/graphics I'm looking to create is something similar to the www.gameprom.com (http://www.gameprom.com) website.
QuoteEmail him to make some $$$ appstore games?
^LOL what he said...
It would be nice to make money - don't get me wrong. I think we could all use some (I have bills to pay but I'm sure mommie will take me back into her basement or I could join a commune.) But, if the game isn't fun - then it's not going to happen.
Someone doing that kind of graphics would need quite a bit of time - which probably rules out most people here, although those who have already released may be able to help in that department.
Well - I guess my next question would be - how much of the graphics portion is the programmer and how much of the actual art falls upon the artist? I'm fairly quick on the graphics, mapping, and 3D modeling portion. That's the part I would like to/prefer to handle. However, I don't know what are the acceptable formats ie. texture maps, obj, and/or 3DS models.
The second question would be - is this even the right place to look?
Did you gota my email?
Well if you can provide all the resources but just need someone to put it together? Sounds like you just need a basic engine. Try creating something with concept art simulatong your game idea.
Got a chance to browse some of your work, it's pretty nice stuff.
Not hostile mate, cynical. Cynical on two counts actually, but I'm glad to see at least one of them (and I'd say both) is wrong. I guess the fact you had an avatar should have clued me in that you weren't likely a spammer, but just so you know the typical spammer we get here posts some generic 'I want to make a game' or 'this is really good' and has a link to a website that sells a product or a service. Was just unfortunate in this case and the fact that they've been on the rise lately hasn't helped.
The second reason why I'm cynical is mostly due to the whole 'I draw but can't program, can someone help me make what I want?' deal. I've been programming for 26 years, online since the 80's and I've seen a lot of changes to the way both work and not all good. One of those is people popping onto programming websites asking someone to do a lot of the work -- although it's most often kids (if you'd asked for help to make an MMO my cynicism levels would have hit new heights or depths :D) who don't really understand how much work is involved. A lot of indie/hobby programmers have a pretty good grasp on both sides of things as a number of them, besides being able to program, can also draw to semi-pro or even pro levels -- in fact it's not that uncommon to meet someone who started in art and picked up programming. Obviously looking at my avatar, I'm not one of those. :)
Now since you are talking more about a business arrangement, none of my initial reservations count.
So that's just where I was coming from with my original post, but since I'm thankfully very wrong I'd like to apologise and wish you well. I really hope you find what you need. Take care.
@ampos - no, I haven't. Send again?
@Scott - thanks man. To be honest, I hate programming LOL. It's a pain in the butt and it's a lot of work. Plus, my memory is bad in general so I always have problems with syntax. I taught myself, web, print, marketing, SEO, Photoshop, Illustrator, AE, basic compositing, 3dsmax, vray - etc. The idea of filling my head with one more thing will push me off a bridge or will definitely push another program back out. And plus I have a feeling it's a very steep climb - especially transitioning from 2D to 3D using these languages.
On the other hand, some very sick individuals really love to program. I'd rather leave that aspect to the experts.
In 3D, art, interior design, and architecture - I think we get the same response/treatment from others - everyone thinks it's a simple "push of the button" when nothing could be further from the truth. I'm used to getting lowballed and pushed around by others. In turn, I have a lot of respect for programmers and fellow designers cause I think it's quite similar.
As for the art, the concept is already there in my head. There's even somewhat similar games on the market already (not being a programmer, they beat me to the punch years back when I first approached some friends.) I just think we could do a much better job as currently these other games just look like blocks on a piece of paper.
If I can see someone else's work/portfolio that shows they've reached a level of proficiency of incorporating 3D and basic accelerometer features, I'd send off a NDA then provide them with sketches to see if it's possible to work on this together.
@hatonastick - no worries man. In 3D I know of a few amazing artists that are also scripters/programmers - they're relatively few tho. Generally they're too busy doing other stuff to have the spare time to even answer forum questions.
QuoteI've been programming for 26 years, online since the 80's and I've seen a lot of changes to the way both work and not all good.
LOL I was 10 when I had a C64 and hooked it up to a modem, somehow got my hands on a BB number and dialed it without realizing what "long distance" was. Later that month when my dad got a $100+ phone bill in the mail, I was grounded for life.
Who didn't get in trouble for BBS phone bills in the 80s? :D
The majority of 3D iPhone and iPad models designed in 3D Studio Max and apps compiled with GLBasic that are on the App Store are published by me. One app even uses the accelerometer but I am interested in the gyroscope! Many of these attributes would not be possible without the help of our community. Some of us need 3D models for games so it's nice to have a 3D modeler around. lunarstudio, that's some really cool 3D work there!!! :good: :good:
You should really check out http://www.sculptris.com/
It's a very awesome program that can turn your concept art into 3d models very easily. It's similar to modeling clay.
If you have a good idea you should do a mock-up, use photoshop to put together some concept shots.
The more you simulate the basics of what you want in a game the easier it is for the programing. In other words if you know how it's supposed to look and function, then you have clear goals for the program.
Gameplay,graphic style and interface are a good start. Like creating a side scroller from your own graphics with layers in photoshop to simulate what your trying to image game wise.
Bear in mind though that if you did use sculptris you would have to seriously reduce the poly count of the models before they became useable in any form of game.
QuoteThe majority of 3D iPhone and iPad models designed in 3D Studio Max and apps compiled with GLBasic that are on the App Store are published by me.
Very cool to have that badge of honor. Interested in seeing how that whole process works (export, texture mapping, etc.). :)
QuoteOne app even uses the accelerometer but I am interested in the gyroscope!
Actually, this is more of gyroscope type of project I think as it's all axis. I think I'm screwing up terminology.
QuoteSome of us need 3D models for games so it's nice to have a 3D modeler around
If I have some spare cycles lying around, feel free to ask. I think I might be slammed the next couple of weeks. When it rains, it pours around here then month-long dry spells.
QuoteThe more you simulate the basics of what you want in a game the easier it is for the programing. In other words if you know how it's supposed to look and function, then you have clear goals for the program.
The minute I get a good response, I'll bang something rough out in under an hour that should highlight most (95%) of everything. The rest are cool little addon ideas.
@Scott_AW: Pixelogic/Zbrush is a very cool company and modeling tool. A lot of colleagues use Zbrush for character modeling in particular - the way it handles organic shapes, fine lines, and wrinkles. That's something a proggie like 3dsmax falls apart handling. Nice to see they have something free out there. Another somewhat similar program to Zbrush is called Modo.
@Leginus: Polygoncruncher or optimize polys within another app such as 3dsmax can do the trick. Probably the best way to handle things are to not create something so high poly to begin with.
Quote from: matchy on 2010-Sep-07
Who didn't get in trouble for BBS phone bills in the 80s? :D
Oddly enough I didn't get in trouble for the bills, just the simple act of tying up the phone. We already plan to bury my Dad with his as we are all convinced he cant do without it. :)
I sent you a PM here.
There have been days I wanted to destroy 3d Studio max, yes...
Could be wrong and I hate to say it on this forum, but it looks like I might need something more like Unity3D to get this project off the ground. Besides price, what are the pros and cons? Can GLBasic handle something such as what this engine is capable of or is it substantially more work? Has anyone tried this?
Thanks!
With Unity, you need to use Javascript. There is supposed to be a Windows version, but I dont think its ready yet, which means you will need a Mac.
You can develop for various mobile phones, but it costs extra.
I didn't like Unity - just didn't do what I kept asking it to do - fortunately, I got a refund...
Just a quick list, may be inaccurate, haven't used Unity in a while now.
Unity3D
======
Pros:
- Advanced IDE
- Multi-Platform IDE - PC, Mac
- C# / JavaScript (could be a con!)
- Can use any Text Editor for source code, including MS Visual Studio
- Advanced material / shader handling
- Optional 3rd Party Plug Ins (Tween, Sprite, Camera, etc)
- Built-In 3D physics engine
Cons:
- Complex IDE for a beginner
- No 2D mode
- Less control, more automated (hard to know what is going to execute next)
GLBasic
=======
Pros:
- Very simple to get started
- Can do pretty much anything, maybe with more coding on your part
- 2D mode, and can be mixed with 3D mode
- Fast prototyping / development time once you learn the ropes
- Direct access to C++ Inline (Unity Pro has this feature too, but for $1500)
Unity is pretty good. I was *this close* (holds fingers very close together) to buying it when they made it freely available :) It works perfectly under Windows.
The paid for version does have some lovely extra features, but for my personal use, they were overpriced. Things like proper realtime shadows are only in the paid for version, and the blobby shadows of the Indie version are rubbish. There are workarounds (essentially creating a sprite out of your 3D object and using that as the shadow), but I couldn't be bothered and dropped it.
With regard to the feature list below, Unity is 3D only, but you can set the camera so that it renders without perspective, effectively giving you a 2D environment.
As to the OP, it's all very well saying you have a good idea, but loads of people have those. To get others onboard, you need to have something to entice them. Even if it's only a cobbled together demo that runs on the PC. If others can see the potential in what you're trying to do, they're much more likely to want to get involved. Yes, programming it may be a hassle for you, but you'll stand a much better chance of achieving your goal.
Alternatively, get your name out there a bit. Look for projects that have a working demo but are looking for 3D artists to join their team. Submit your stuff and get your name known on a few forums. If you can come at from that angle, you might also find others are willing to work with you, simply because at the very least the game will look good!
QuoteAs to the OP, it's all very well saying you have a good idea, but loads of people have those. To get others onboard, you need to have something to entice them. Even if it's only a cobbled together demo that runs on the PC. If others can see the potential in what you're trying to do, they're much more likely to want to get involved.
I have received a few emails from interested parties so far. The main issue is that the games they have shown tend to be overly complicated (requires a 100 page manual to play), some major language barrier issues, or the examples they show are mainly 2D.
As I said before, if I see a pretty amazing portfolio that looks like it has potential to translate what I need (think 3d type of pinball game but not quite), I'd send over a NDA followed by some screenshots.
It's not the first time I've had an idea take off. In fact (and not bragging), I just happened to see one of them randomly as a national commercial for the first time last night. A lot of people have ideas, very few are good ones, and even fewer of the good ones get executed. I think the key here is proper management of crowd-sourcing and looking for others with a solid track-record.
QuoteYes, programming it may be a hassle for you, but you'll stand a much better chance of achieving your goal.
Unfortunately, I maintain 8 websites and run a 3D company, marketing, manage gf aggro, and all the rest that entails which takes a load of time. I can spit out 3D graphics in a blink of an eye, but the programming aspect is something I'd rather leave to a professional that has already been there before instead of wasting precious time. It's not laziness but rather efficiency.
Quote from: Hatonastick on 2010-Sep-07
Oddly enough I didn't get in trouble for the bills, just the simple act of tying up the phone.:)
Yeah - that's how late nights started!
Quote from: lunarstudio on 2010-Sep-07I have received a few emails from interested parties so far. The main issue is that the games they have shown tend to be overly complicated (requires a 100 page manual to play), some major language barrier issues, or the examples they show are mainly 2D.
As I said before, if I see a pretty amazing portfolio that looks like it has potential to translate what I need (think 3d type of pinball game but not quite), I'd send over a NDA followed by some screenshots.
I don't want to come across as overly negative here, but it sounds like you're on a bit of a fishing trip. Chuck out some bait (of fancy 3D renders - none of which are game related), and hope some programmers bite.
QuoteA lot of people have ideas, very few are good ones, and even fewer of the good ones get executed.
I'm presuming your idea is a good one then? How can anyone tell from the phrase "type of pinball game, but not quite"?
QuoteUnfortunately, I maintain 8 websites and run a 3D company, marketing, manage gf aggro, and all the rest that entails which takes a load of time.
You're not alone in being busy. Programmers aren't sitting twiddling their thumbs waiting for an artist/muscian to come along and pretty up their game. They're getting on with the job and making progress. Once they've got something to show, they can look for artists and muscians.
Seriously, I would suggest that you setup a website and create some game related 3D models in "the blink of an eye". Tanks, spaceships, buildings, characters, street furniture, anything. If you want people to send you their portfolio, at least show everyone else yours, and how it relates to games.
Quote from: matchy on 2010-Sep-08
Quote from: Hatonastick on 2010-Sep-07
Oddly enough I didn't get in trouble for the bills, just the simple act of tying up the phone.:)
Yeah - that's how late nights started!
I'd wondered not too long ago how mine started. You are absolutely right! :D
Quote from: lunarstudio on 2010-Sep-07I have received a few emails from interested parties so far. The main issue is that the games they have shown tend to be overly complicated (requires a 100 page manual to play), some major language barrier issues, or the examples they show are mainly 2D.
...
As I said before, if I see a pretty amazing portfolio that looks like it has potential to translate what I need (think 3d type of pinball game but not quite), I'd send over a NDA followed by some screenshots.
...
I can spit out 3D graphics in a blink of an eye, but the programming aspect is something I'd rather leave to a professional that has already been there before instead of wasting precious time. It's not laziness but rather efficiency.
I'm with the Bursar. Your initial post reminds me of one at daz3d's forums, and IMHO the problem seems to be that you want everything from your potential partners but will only pony up your side after they meet your requirements... Let me put it another way. You're not saying:
"Here's the kind of thing I'm looking for - here are some graphics and a quick animation or 5 of the kind of thing I need you to be able to code, contact me if you can actually do it to a professional level" you're saying "I'm being coy - contact me if you're good at 3D programming for the iPhone, and can prove that to me before I'll show you mine".
One is open and helpful, it need only gain correspondance from people who are intersted and able, the other is cagey and uninformative, requiring more work from everybody to try and find their partners for the dance without even knowing what style of music will be played.
Honestly - if the 3D side is so quick and easy, put together some samples and show some animations which depict the kind of thing you need doing. Make your models low poly, with a single bitmap for the texture of each model (a seperate one for a bump map if required). Treat people as equals rather than as tradesmen being asked to apply at the back door ;)
Quote from: Hatonastick on 2010-Sep-08
Quote from: matchy on 2010-Sep-08
Quote from: Hatonastick on 2010-Sep-07
Oddly enough I didn't get in trouble for the bills, just the simple act of tying up the phone.:)
Yeah - that's how late nights started!
I'd wondered not too long ago how mine started. You are absolutely right! :D
Bluebox and callingcards >:D
Well ... hopefully we are more or less grown up now.
Quote from: ketil on 2010-Sep-08
Quote from: Hatonastick on 2010-Sep-08
Quote from: matchy on 2010-Sep-08
Quote from: Hatonastick on 2010-Sep-07
Oddly enough I didn't get in trouble for the bills, just the simple act of tying up the phone.:)
Yeah - that's how late nights started!
I'd wondered not too long ago how mine started. You are absolutely right! :D
Bluebox and callingcards >:D
Well ... hopefully we are more or less grown up now.
I knew I was grown up when I learned about the breakfast cereal toy whistle was it's predecessor. :S
Although now-a-days it's nice to see retro BBS telnet servers.
Whatever happened to breakfast cereal toys? Were they banned or did cereal companies worry that they might get sued if little Johnny rams it down his throat and carks it?
Anyway, back on topic. This is one of the oddest threads I've come across in a long while. A professional artists (that enjoyed promoting his site, but not showing any gaming related media) wants (others) to make a game for him, but is too busy to provide an insight in what HE actually wants, but mocks the regulars in a forum that he's only just joined. Bonkers.
Show us that YOU are worthy of the attention of the regulars here - not the other way around. The more you show and say, the more likely it is that you'll find the person (or people) that you need to get the job done.
@Bursar. You can think whatever you want. I run a company currently and have a track record (if it's not painfully obvious) that I know what I'm doing. If you're not convinced by my artistic skills, then you're more than welcome to have your own opinion on ASCII art. If it's that painful for someone to send over some screen grabs of their portfolio and sign a NDA, then they're probably not worth my time. I don't see that anyone has anything to lose, but you definitely done get anywhere by sitting on your ass and staring out the window.
Personally, I don't take your attacks at all constructively. I'm not bragging, but if you can't see that I'm an artist and that I have some element of a brain or skills - then there's little help for you. Show me a portfolio or please quit wasting other people's time that are actually trying to make something happen in this world.
My two cents.
The only thing that is painfully obvious to me is that you checked your manners in at the door :(
Various attempts have been made to suggest not insulting the people you say you are trying to recruit. Why is it so hard for you to knock out some of the 3D graphics that you claim to be able to knock out in the blink of an eye? Why so hard to ... get along?
Cliff - you agreed with Bursar before so I know what side of the fence you sit on.
I came to this forum, introduced myself, and asked nicely.
First I got attacked for being a spammer. I had to be on the defense for that. Where's the manners there? Oh wait....
Secondly, I was nice about what I was trying to do - all I asked if anyone had some spare cycles and would be interested in an idea. I'm sorry I don't want to share it with everyone. Still, a few of you guys troll, nerd rage, and are hostile to someone being nice. I've never been on a forum where I just got attacked right off the bat, and I've been alot of forums over the past 10 years...
Thirdly, some of you guys still can't look at my work and somehow think, "this guy has decent art - perhaps he knows what he's doing. WAIT A MINUTE - HE DOESN'T MAKE SPACESHIP DURRR." However, if you don't like my work, then please keep your opinion to yourself. I'm not looking for compliments - I could care less for compliments - just showing that I do artwork. Plain and simple.
Fourthly,
QuoteVarious attempts have been made to suggest not insulting the people you say you are trying to recruit
I'm not insulting anyone at this point except those that came at me to begin with.
QuoteWhy is it so hard for you to knock out some of the 3D graphics that you claim to be able to knock out in the blink of an eye?
As I said before, if you can't tell from the work I've done, then I wasn't put on this planet to impress you. If you can't see the forest for the trees, then go on your merry way. Sayonara. Arrivederci. On the other hand, if you (metaphorically speaking) want to shoot me an email, I'm sure there would be a lot of things which could be discussed including other successful startups, marketing, etc. that I've been involved with. Perhaps that actually might massage your paranoia/suspicions.
I'm not looking to pass off "all the hard work" on to somebody else. I think that's some of your attitude but it couldn't be further from the truth. I too spent years refining my craft (and other skills) just as some of you have done with programming. I also pull my own weight - quite heavily (16 hour days 7 days a week for the past 10 years.)
QuoteWhy so hard to ... get along?
I didn't start the attacks and tearing other people down with paranoia/suspicion. Just saying.
All I'm here to do is to see if anyone would possibly be interested in a project. If you're not interest, stop trolling and go away. Thanks. ;)
Really, I dont see anything bad about thios "programmer recruiter".
Also, I have not been in this forum as long as mostg of you, but I really dont see the problem.
Maybe he has not shown us what kind of work he needs, so some of us are out of target (not enough programming skills, or not want to be on his kind of project). But out of this, he has been good enough for me.
Thanks Ampos.
I showed a friend this thread (and outsider) and this is what he had to say. I think he summarized it:
Quoteseems that the forum is filled with people who are all used to each other. they seem to have huge trust issues that need to be called to their attention. If they're interested, skilled, and want the money, then they should just contact you.
instead they're joining up to find out what it is first and refusing to put any faith into the situation. pork barreling the project
i say... call them a bunch of scared little sheep that are hiding in a corner. if one is courageous enough to step out and try then more power to him/her. otherwise they're a bunch of idiotic weaklings that need to go fire themselves from a cannon
lol... I just don't see the point in attacking me. There's some serious trust issues going on here and from outsider's perspective, not only is it really weird to the point of being bizarre, but should be addressed.
I haven't attacked you, and I apologise if my postings came across in that way, as it certainly wasn't my intention. I can see from your website that your 3D renders and animations are impressive, but that doesn't mean that you can create low poly assets suitable for a game. I was simply suggesting that you create a few models, stick them in a scene and mock up some game type screenshots.
You're not alone at being new to this particular forum - I've only been here a short time myself, but I have found the people friendly and willing to help where they can.
Quote from: lunarstudio on 2010-Sep-09
Quoteseems that the forum is filled with people who are all used to each other. they seem to have huge trust issues that need to be called to their attention.
Actually, I am new here myself - and I was on your "side" (if there's any "taking sides" to speak of lol), trying to get you to see how you come across from what you have typed and get you to see how to come acroiss less prickly. I am sorry your original pist reads like spam. No-one intended any ill feelings towards the poster if it was genuine, and no spikey response was necessary.
Have you posted at DAZ3D at all, I wonder?
As a moderator, I delete at least 5 spam posts a day from this site (which is not too many, considering other sites I moderate), but most of them are either touting their wares and have no interest in gaming, or pretend that they are interested in gaming and still tout their site. It really is impossible to tell at times the genuine users from the spammers. Others, like myself, that have been here a while tend to think that first posts, like yours are automatically presumed to be spam. Sometimes we are wrong. But, we did give you the benefit of the doubt, and I don't believe HOAS or my own posts were hostile. If you felt this, then I apologise.
Back on topic. If you have a portfolio and are interested, please toss me an email. If you don't, then you don't and there's my decision right there. Very simple.
I receive on average 3-4 resumes a day for the past 8+ years. You can tell a lot from one quick glance at someone's portfolio. If they don't even have one, I'm not going to even waste my time.
QuoteI can see from your website that your 3D renders and animations are impressive, but that doesn't mean that you can create low poly assets suitable for a game.
I don't mean any offense by this, but I think your knowledge of 3D is extremely limited.
I'm sure if I can model this:
(http://www.lunarstudio.com/rendering-gallery/image-illustrations/technical-illustration/3d-product-model.jpg)
(http://www.lunarstudio.com/rendering-gallery/image-illustrations/technical-illustration/XTI-lens-model-rear.jpg)
...I could probably model a low poly version lol. I don't know what more you want to see - the Eiffel Tower created with toothpicks? Geez...
Guys, either send this guy an email or ignore him and move on. PLEASE :offtopic: