Having put my last two apps online, one a util and the other a game. On both AppStore and PlayStore and getting zero purchases for either it has struck me the importance of Ads and/or InApp purchases. We are competing in a strong marketplace on both stores and having a LITE and FULL just isn't cutting it anymore (imho). Can some of the better coders amongst us collaborate or assist in finding a solution that Gernot can implement into the core of GLB. Adding libs, messing with sdks and adding .mm files is all good and well but personally I feel that GLB would be far more solid if these features were part of the core.
Maybe there is a way to add modules to the core to make things easier for newbies and seasoned pros alike to add functionality. Ultimately the money I've spent and the return I've had just isn't worth it and it would be sad for me to not bother with the AppStore and the PlayStore because ultimately leaving this effectively means leaving GLB and doing something else to make money. Car Boots maybe lol :-)
Just an opinion I'd be happy to hear others thoughts.
Seems like a good idea to me too. :good:
Karma Miwa would property been free, because its is fun to develop that game and did not doing money.
Yes that way extensions works in glbasic is very different between Android and iOS example. In Android you need expand the SDL java file, while you need to add mm for iOS. This can confuction beginner, but not sure its better a alternative way that way its works.
The best method is simply using the same idea behind AndroidExtras and extend that to use iOS as well trought the same functions its use (GPS and keyboard exists in iOS, and could been cool implementing that too).
So the only best way is property make sure we use functions to call the extras, so its can been extended to other OS when used, so nothing breaks compatible.
Am also pretty sure InApp purchase works pretty much the same on all OS, so its a area that could done that. Either as glbasic commands, or simply trought a module with Android Extras style....
I just think the language is lovely to work in and there's a whole heap of functionality being used that we really need for apps now and missing out on.
Yes I think this a very important point, and we don't have.. I look the AGK of the DarkBasic and they have implemented all this things...
Perhaps another way and this can be interesting for all people it's open a market, something like Unity Store, and the people can sell their codes or graphics. In example Shiva3d all scripts of facebook, social networks, and this things was of pay...
http://www.appgamekit.com/documentation/Reference/Extras.htm yep, they are all in and then out perform glBasic in that term.
So Glbasic missing some sort a good plugin system like that and compatible with both iOS and Android (but howover they do have a bigger team than Glbasic have).
InApp purchase is very important today and we still missing that on Android, and partyly for iOS too. Howover there is a lib for iOS, which can could integrate that way using simular functions like that link, so its could been easier to perfrom and in uses.
Eailer im did looked on Admon, but im did got Activity trouble with that on Android, so im gave up. The required SDK and multitastking was the most issue (they also required SDK 2.3, but Glbasic still uses SDK 2.2). Today its seen most of those Acticity have been fixed, so im will tryout LeadBolt those day (which require SDK 2.2 here, so that pretty nice). Howover im do focus on the Android first here, and will integrate to AndroidExtras when done. on iOS iADS should of course been used, but LeadBolt do exists to that platform too.
I completely backup and support everything that has been said here. iOS market is a nightmare the same ones are up there all the time. Inapp purchase could come in handy I guess, but it all boils down to the same thing.
I must admit though that I have had my fair share so far but I have worked my butts of for it. Im trying to have more fun now instead of thinking big.
In-app purchase is way off my taste, I never bought a game with such features. Tried one or two of the freemium things but thanks they were not my cup of tea.
Adds inside games as banners over game field also gets me off. I would perfectly tolerate the likes of adds you saw on Lotus turbo sprit or the non intrusive kind you get on shufflepuck cantina (ye the android excellent remake).
Apart from my personal tastes, I have to agree we should get those working. They feel important on today´s scene.
Quote from: erico on 2013-Jun-26
In-app purchase is way off my taste, I never bought a game with such features
In-App purchase can be used to unlock a demo to full though as well remember :-) No need for LITE and FULL
Indeed. And let's face it many people avoid getting apps which say lite,demo,free etc.
So we are missing thousands of downloads.
My views anyway. :)
im dont like those which purchase coins etc for insane high price (which im often avoid too). But howover there is many good example how In-App Purchase is nice:
Purchasing magazines, unlock all levels (which seen more more popular, which im could do that in Greedy Mouse), Games in a emulator, Game packs in a Solitaire app etc, unlock premium version with extra functions and so on. Here inApp purchase is pretty nice. Howover we might not like that, but its seen we can get much better sale than doing tre trandionelly Light/Premium.
If we dont have inapp-purchase, but if we can integrate ads, and then doing a much better light version of a game with all levels from full version, due we can get revenue from the ads instead, due hopefuly much more downloads without removing to many functions (that is not needed). Howover im those days/ weeks looking, and see im can integrate a ads service and put that to the ANDROIDEXTRAS section (Android highest priotity here). This is about that example WordFued works. The game have a paid and a ads version, and im like that way its done....
The problems of integrating new functionality in the base language are many. First, a lot of work to implement this and second make it and testing for many platforms. The answer for this lot of work is let the users to collaborate with components.
I think the solution for all the new functionality present and future is a plugin or component system for the language. Like gbal libraries or static libraries but better, updated and more integrated, like the libraries are used in Python, .Net or Java. We need a review and improvement of user libraries. With this, the users could create free or paid libraries to extend the language.
Other mobile frameworks support components/plugins too and have a big participation from the user community. I think this is the next big step in GLBasic.
Look at this page, Binpress, it's a market to sell apps and components in source code (objetive-c for example) wich other developers can use. It's an example of collaborative working to get a better development environment. They have some things free too.
http://www.binpress.com/browse/objective-c
Good point hardyx!
Quote from: spicypixel on 2013-Jun-26
Quote from: erico on 2013-Jun-26
In-app purchase is way off my taste, I never bought a game with such features
In-App purchase can be used to unlock a demo to full though as well remember :-) No need for LITE and FULL
I agree and believe in the potential such implementation shall have.
But personally, I never really got into demos myself, the only exception being the Cadaver (bitmap brothers) demos, that were mini full games telling the tales before the main game...they are almost a collectors piece. I love those kind of demos (I got the cu amiga one :)).
To be truthfull, I get to demos and wips once in a while, like the Broforce or Hammerwatch I posted off topic. But they are somehow different, more like a work in progress and test for purpose on indie stuff. The spelunky or kofXIV demos for xbox were really horrible. But that is all only my opinion.
I see the benefits we get with these extra functionality, specially the way hardyx described.
From experience, apps get popular due to market research and exposure. Blaming the app stores and GLBasic is unfair if you believe a product is profitable. That is why I don't wreck myself everyday creating pipe dream apps without a demand in the market otherwise it is just common gambling. :whistle:
Exactly well said!
Quote from: spicypixel on 2013-Jun-26
On both AppStore and PlayStore and getting zero purchases for either it has struck me the importance of Ads and/or InApp purchases. We are competing in a strong marketplace on both stores and having a LITE and FULL just isn't cutting it anymore (imho).
Releasing a free version and a paid version at once it isn't a good option, because most users go to the easy path. It's better release the paid version first, and then when the sales decrease, release the lite version to get known the app again. Or updating the app frequently, fixing possible errors and add something the users like.
Quote from: matchy on 2013-Jun-27
From experience, apps get popular due to market research and exposure. Blaming the app stores and GLBasic is unfair if you believe a product is profitable. That is why I don't wreck myself everyday creating pipe dream apps without a demand in the market otherwise it is just common gambling. :whistle:
We still need to be able to compete on a level playing field and having apps without features that users expect or take for granted will affect our leverage. It's not down to market research it's down to luck in many ways, who could have expected throwing birds at pigs would be so successful, what market research can you possibly acquire to come to that conclusion? Many useful apps rely on social networking to create accounts (fb/twitter) and have device ui components for interaction we don't have that but as we write games it doesn't matter.
Market research can be studied for apps I agree, we have the internet to see what trends are happening and we can identify areas that we can fill, the same cannot be said for games. For example four pics one word, very popular, produce a clone, people want the original. How can you market research the game that is going to be popular? As soon as you identify a genre that is popular, there are already a million clones and the truth is someone else has identified it first (or more likely wrote a game that was lucky enough to be popular).
The same can be said of many incredibly successful entrepreneurs or businesses. Agreed they had a product/service or vision that was unique and was geared perfectly for the future but the truth is that in nearly every case it was a chance meeting with another, a so-called lucky chance encounter that led these individuals together to work and go from strenght to strength.
All in all it's still a lucky gamble regardless of anything, the best we can do is arm ourselves with all the tools that others have. Never go to a gunfight with a pocketknife is all I'm saying.
Quote from: hardyx on 2013-Jun-27
Releasing a free version and a paid version at once it isn't a good option, because most users go to the easy path. It's better release the paid version first, and then when the sales decrease, release the lite version to get known the app again. Or updating the app frequently, fixing possible errors and add something the users like.
I don't see many free or lite versions now I just see one version which can be upgraded within the app/game. The reasoning being "catch them in the mood for the sale", if they are getting into your product and just finished the last level but can unlock the full game for 50p. The psychology is there "they are likely to do it". If however they need to load the AppStore, search the product again, locate the full version and then buy it, there's a chance they will be distracted, change their mind, possibly read a review "full version doesnt seem worth it stick with the free one" or whatever. It's all about impulse buying and fast sales.
We live in an age of 100mph transactions, thought and decisions. :D
PS: To all that think I'm slating GLB I'm not I'm just saying as a community we should push ourselves to get these things and help Gernot if we can.
for IOS, there is this code about In-App Code:
http://www.glbasic.com/forum/index.php?topic=6711.30
That should been translated into easier functions, then the same functions could go for Android as well. Howover Android dont use Restore, but is done on setup, while Apple require a restore button for iOS.
I tested this on ios recentlty and I could not get it working. There's a lot of libs out there that no longer work on GLB unfortunately. This is not GLBs fault, Apple just seems to continuously move the API goalposts each ios revision.
Spicy we know you are not throwing Glbasic. At least I know :)
Infact I feel the same way. Of all thats been said here I still consider iap the most important one.
Your recent post is so true. The chances of someone going through your so called lite version getting to the end and then going to the app store to download the full copy is just not happening anymore, at least not in the numbers we want.
And that is if the person downloads a lite version in the first place, which only 1% does.
However having the game there which at the end of level 3 or something like that gives you the prompt to unlock all contents at £0.69 will surely increase that 1% to maybe even 10%. now that's marketing for you :)
Just take a look at the store and you see hundreds of top apps as free with iap, we just cannot deny that, so or you move in that direction or you're just not going to make a dime, if that's what you want.
Regards
Quote from: Omadan on 2013-Jun-27
Just take a look at the store and you see hundreds of top apps as free with iap, we just cannot deny that, so or you move in that direction or you're just not going to make a dime, if that's what you want.
Regards
I totally agree. As bigsofty has mentioned the downside of supporting features such as inApp via the community is that if it's not maintained it doesn't work due to revisions etc. It makes me wonder if supporting so many formats in GLB is spreading Gernot thinly, compared to targeting, one or two and personally being able to maintain them to the fullest. Only meant as discussion :-) not in anyway a bash, he's doing a marvellous job, pity we can't clone hime :D
I'm like new platforms, and we can't get anything yet, so you must get best as you can with the limits...
there is a nice iOS6 based torturial how to do inapp purchase, Howover it's used a iOS 6 ui control, but its not needed in glbasic anyway.
I'm not think gernot won't add that anytime soon. So don't hold your breath on that one.
Howover my next game, karma Miwa would property give away free, and then later can eventuelly integreate ads etc. that game was not created with money in mind, but for fun.
I'm guess you should ask DaCarSoft if he want to look on that one? He is pretty good iOS programmer. I'm will sooner or later, if not Fivesprite will do that for Android? Howover im do more look on ads again. Not sure deadline or where om look on that yet.
Read this article to see how you can make a lot of money with in-app purchases:
http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RaminShokrizade/20130626/194933/The_Top_F2P_Monetization_Tricks.php (http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RaminShokrizade/20130626/194933/The_Top_F2P_Monetization_Tricks.php)
Unfortunately it's harder to succeed using in-app purchases with genuine games of skill. The games making the most money trick customers.
I dont know, as a games player I detest iAPs, as an app developer I am drawn by their revenue generating aspects. :S
i'm willing to add InApp Purchases to my game (IAP of OUYA) but it is still not supported.
Quote from: bigsofty on 2013-Jul-05
I dont know, as a games player I detest iAPs, as an app developer I am drawn by their revenue generating aspects. :S
I feel similar to it.
Thanks marovada, that is a nice article.
Reminded me of a discussion about one xbox game from a good franchise.
Last version was considered crap by most gamers here, but a few tried to argue that buying some extras made the game good. Nobody else fell for it :good:
The main argument, even from the girls, were that if a game is not good enough as it is (triple A costs horrors in brazil...), then it is crap, no IAP.
Still, that is more or less the barrage to break on ouyeah and that article helps out.
Most people don't like Ads in programs, even if they are free. I do think it generates a more positive feel to a program if there aren't any.
Quote from: MrTAToad on 2013-Jul-05
Most people don't like Ads in programs, even if they are free. I do think it generates a more positive feel to a program if there aren't any.
I think the same. :)
I tolerate ads in game if done cleverly and non intrusive.
Like I said before, ads on road tracks of a racer don´t bother me. A full screen add without click tricks once every few levels is also ok.
Free angry birds with constant on-screen add over touch playfield is a no no to me.
Yes, that is a right pain. Don't like the game anyway...
Me neither Mr.T.
But the way ads are into the shufflepuck cantina (shufflepuck cafe remake) are quite ok for me.
ps: :-[ heck I suspect I already posted about it before...maybe I´m getting redundant. :S :-[
We're going off-topic here. The question isn't about debating which ads work which don't what people like and what people don't. In-App Purchases, Ads and Social Gaming are the benchmark, can we get GLB to this benchmark, this is the real question we need to be discussing and asking ourselves here.
Would be a great start to have fully woking IAP.
I'm hoping I can implement IAP for my next update. Anyone can guide me in the right direction.
I want it working for any iOS 4.3 or higher.
http://www.atgames.eu/puzzle-craft.html
Whis is a game created by my friends and its only inApp purchases they are make a lot of money ...
I think that inApp purchases and few other things should be added ...
I Love GLBasic but becouse its missing thie few features im looking for other similar software :AGK, Monkey, Construct2, Citrus engine they are very good but im really have a fun coding in GLB and i believe that this features will be added ...
Yeah I'm finding it quite frustrating not to have everything out-of-the-box. I'm loving GLB, but I am thinking of looking at other options now as I've waited to see what develops and there's nothing concrete to determine if anything is being done to provide such functionality. I'm hoping GLB 11 will have these features as standard (even with another purchase(upgrade) option) but I'm beginning to think that we will only have HTML5. I'm just guessing, but there's been no discussion of GLB 11 features other than HTML5 on these boards.
Feeling sad ....
I know that is surely some more work, but many others game langage ( like Monkey http://www.monkeycoder.co.nz/ ) already contain AdMod/iAd support out-of the box ! So it is surely a needed plus for GlBasic.
Any serious mobile coder knows that unless you have a real advertisement campaign for your app/game, in-app ad like leadbolt/admob/iad are the only way to monetize the time spent on the dev.
Please, consider it ;)
Hi, Using GLBasic I created a little meditation app and charge $1.99 for it, after sales have slowed down I thought i'd create a free/lite version to hopefully entice people to take the next step. So I created a dumbed down version of my app with a bit of advertising telling people in the app what they will get with the full paid version, submitted the lite version to apple for review, I was starting to think something was wrong when they told me my app "requires additional review time", then came the dreaded rejected email.. anyway their response of my lite version is below.
"Rather than providing a lite or trial version, you may wish to use In App Purchase to provide access to purchasing additional application features. In App Purchase provides a seamless, in app purchasing experience for your users, and an improved selling experience for you. "
Looks like they are trying to push people to upgrading the app in the app using in app purchase..
Even more reasons to fully support in app purchase I'm afraid.
This all moves very fast and we are falling behind.
That sound at ýou have did a demo version of a full version, when you advertising what you will get in the full version. That is what Apple call that as a Demo. You should only do a link to the paid version, not elsewise.
Anyway im did forget to look on the Android inapp system, due other reason not to been doing here. But when im look on InApp, im can only do that with the Android version, not iOS. IM thinks Android is a bit more important than iOS here.
Im have no release date about when and how its would been done.
Howover its would been pretty nice to see possible to expand GLBASIC with extensions for multiply platforms, just like what AMOS could for Amiga. Not just with functions.
today im looked on the iOS part, then im found this InApp Store system:
http://blog.mugunthkumar.com/coding/mkstorekit-4-0-supporting-auto-renewable-subscriptions/
im thinks glbasic can uses that very well and look like a great inapp store system from iOS5 and up (here om dont care iOS4 and under is unsupported).
Im hope in the end, its can been integrated something to this in glbasic:
// is the inapp item available?
FUNCTION InAppPurchase_isAvailable: iID$
iID$=InApp_ReplaceID$(iID$)
DEPRINT("InAppPurchase_isAvailable: "+iID$)
?IFDEF WIN32
LOCAL ok=GetStr$(InApp_HashID$(iID$), "Purchases")
IF ok=1 THEN RETURN 1
?ENDIF
RETURN 0
ENDFUNCTION
// purchase button pressed, start the purchase progress!
FUNCTION InAppPurchase_Activate: iID$
DEPRINT("InAppPurchase_Activate(): "+iID$)
iID$=InApp_ReplaceID$(iID$)
?IFDEF WIN32
InAppPurchase_Finished(iID$)
?ENDIF
ENDFUNCTION
// A Purchase have just been activated and then its should been saved here locally
FUNCTION InAppPurchase_Finished: iID$
DEPRINT("InAppPurchase_Finished(): "+iID$)
INAPP_PURCHASE$=iID$
iID$=InApp_ReplaceID$(iID$)
SetStr(InApp_HashID$(iID$), "Purchases", 1)
ENDFUNCTION
// you most do a restore feature for IOS to keep Apple happy to recover all
// perlament purchased items. Its handled by this function and might return
// a error to INAPPERROR$
FUNCTION InAppPurchase_Restore:
DEPRINT("InAppPurchase_Restore()")
ENDFUNCTION
// this function checking any ongoing purchases and callback when done.
// mustbeen done IN the main loop, where items is used
// (its dont spam the inapp-servers IF no purchases is done)
FUNCTION InAppPurchase_Update:
IF INAPP_INIT=0
ENDIF
ENDFUNCTION
// hash an item to save locally when a purchase have been succed.
FUNCTION InApp_HashID$: iID$
LOCAL DID$=PLATFORMINFO$("ID")+iID$
DEPRINT("InApp_HashID$(): "+DID$)
DID$=ENCRYPT$(DID$, LEFT$(DID$, 5))
DID$=HashNumber(DID$)+""+HashNumber(PLATFORMINFO$("ID"))+""+HashNumber(iID$)+""+472882049
RETURN DID$
ENDFUNCTION
// some replaceID, because the ingame ID mightbeen different then the store
// item id (AND even various on platforms). This function is called internal,
// but you must return correct ID.
FUNCTION InApp_ReplaceID$: iID$
?IFDEF IPHONE
IF iID$="item 01" OR iID$="0" THEN RETURN "com.company.item01"
IF iID$="item 02" OR iID$="1" THEN RETURN "com.company.item02"
?ENDIF
RETURN iID$
ENDFUNCTION
this is just a stump code of course for faking purchases for Windows, but hope glbasic functions can been shared between OS.
PS. Im have seen the old inapp code and there is some thing missing, so its more work than excepted (of course).
im just got the iOS Storekit to accept purchase a non consumable item in Greedy Mouse with iOS (which im trought im would done Android version first here). Howover needing to checkout the restore feature. But that mkstorekit can work very well with glbasic. Of course only tested in the sandbox version, but its seen all works.
howover its uses uniqueIdentifier doing for iOS5 only, but Apple reject that today. Howover im found this, which can fix that issue: https://github.com/MugunthKumar/MKStoreKit/issues/142
The controller its self have not been used yet, but just want to been the safe side. Also Im guess Gernot could uses that to for the platform id, so its can more unique.
EDIT: That code diddent work, but then im used OpenUDID instead, which was very easy to do.
Howover its still early on that term.
im have finally implemted inapp purchases to Greedy Mouse in iOS version, and seen its succesfull working with the sandboxing version. The only thing im still missing is the price information.
So im highly recommered to uses mkstorekit for integrate inapp purchases to iOS (even the require few change to avoid using the depracted UDID function, but to uses openUdid instead).
im will release the code after when im sendt v1.4 to Apple and that version got approved. Im will do that in the Bonus section. Im think in the middle or in end of the september.
So its still possible with iOS5 and iOS6 doing that. Howover iOS 4.3 and down will NOT supported inapp purchases at all, but here, im dont care.
PS. Now im need to done the very delayed Android & OUYA inapp purchases by using the same glbasic functions, so its seamless as possible can uses trhought multiplatform.
Ok so Space we can say that the thing you are doing will work for iOS 4.3+ right?
If thats the case I cannot wait for your tutorial.
Thanks
MKStoreKit require iOS5.0 and up, so iOS 4.3 is unsupported. Howover its not a issue today, due only very few procent uses that anyway.
Anyway im have just posted in the bonus section and the progress is still early, but its does works now in both iOS5 and iOS6.
Here is it (you require a 100+ post to see it):
http://www.glbasic.com/forum/index.php?topic=9442.0
PS. Howover im need doing a better torturial, like a good glbasic example, but how the functions its self is self explained (and do the Android version need done, its will uses the same glbasic functions).
Quote from: spacefractal on 2013-Sep-01
Here is it (you require a 100+ post to see it):
http://www.glbasic.com/forum/index.php?topic=9442.0
Why restrict to 100+ posts?
its a bonus section for experimed users and the code can been confuctions for beginner and eventuelly dosent got downloaded by bots and more.
HOWOVER, if a admin thinks its should been in the Beta Tests forum (due its soo earcly, but workable), fell free that post move to there.
Quote from: spacefractal on 2013-Sep-01
its a bonus section for experimed users and the code can been confuctions for beginner and eventuelly dosent got downloaded by bots and more.
HOWOVER, if a admin thinks its should been in the Beta Tests forum (due its soo earcly, but workable), fell free that post move to there.
I'd like to have access to it but I don't have 100 posts =D
I'm cant move it, it's up to a admin. they fell free to move it.
Any updates on implementing in-app purchase functionality for GLBasic? I too am keen on this because this is fast becoming the mobile industry standard. That's why I've been looking more and more into Corona lately because of this functionality.
look in the Beta Forum. There is some early code from me for MKStoreKit for iOS. Soon im have done the OUYA version of inapp purchases (howover by now only non consumable is supported).
For OUYA, you need the SDK 4 upgrade for glbasic (which is in the Bonus section, here im wont move it outside, but im are willing to give link to the big download in pms).
Gernot or a Admin can do fell free to upload to that website (or a Dropbox account) and then open up for others to use that (and then move it outside the Bonus section).
Im have uploaded an Beta 2, which fix some missing files for iOS (version 5+ requried) as well OUYA version isworking.
The might take some time to understand how thing works, due the improper document, but hope fully in the next week im create a good example using those functions.
Other stores is still missing (such as Google Play). For Google Play its mostly only the Java code that need to been implemeted.
Good job space. Credits to you man. I'm on holiday but when I'm back I'll try implement IAP for iOS.
I'm after iOS only.
Thanks again mate.
Regards
v1.4 of Greedy Mouse is now out for iOS AppStore. Howover its seen its accepting all purchases immediately in the startup (can been checked, if all doors automatic open in the first village, even you have no stars). Im are not sure why its does?
1. Howover im downloaded the game from my dev account, that could been that reason?
2. Another reason could been its accepting all purchases, if its found a valid udid included in the provision?
Its was all working fine when tested on Sandbox, and did all what its should. But of course im cannot test it here inside, so im need if one of you, which did not download checks its out, anything working.
PS. "The Premium key" is also free into monday, but its should not "unlock all levels" from the start, nor restore. So im guess its really just a the account used from download that did that (which im hopefully is that).
Today got OPENIAP inapp purchases to work today on Android. Howover even OPENIAP supports various Android stores, im have only tested with managed products and with Google Play.
Also its require a fair bit of setup to work and you need to have a spare Android device, because you cannot use your default Google Account under purchase testing (due you cant even logout on your device without delete anything, damn Google).
Howover checkout the Beta forum for the new version. So its should now works fro iOS, OUYA and OPENIAP.
Im do hope Gernot a day implement all work to the next version of Glbasic Beta include sdk upgrade and all (which would been much easier to setup).
Well done, you've worked hard on this, it's very appreciated SF. :good: I would also like to see this integrated(and personally an easy method of using a user pre-installed set of SDK's from within GLB) into GLB at some point, if possible.
Property I'm could do a installer which install all files in a time? Both sdk as well adding android extras....