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Main forum => GLBasic - en => Topic started by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-12

Title: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-12
Today I'm have dedicated I'm will leave both iOS and Android market. The reason is im fell the mobile market is not what its have been before at all... and im have not earn a cliam in the last two year at all. Steam have totally overtake the market for me.

The maintain of the mobileplatforms seens to been pretty much none fune and annoying and sometimes they also breaks compatible with no reasons at all.

Now example, Apple have dedicated to obsolute my mac (last year thought), which im now have sold, and im did newer really go back again to a virtual system, due updates, updates and another updates and upgrades. Its take hell of time.

Google is also NOT that much better. They have own issues and recently require the project move to Android Studio. its a bout a least 2-3gb download and im newer got into that system at all.... just to support few thing with newer platforms. Its no fun for me and im fell im used too much time with no gain at all.

Even some major company in Denmark does not like them anymore, last time im have heard, due heavy none seance maintime of apps.

So Android and iOS is simply not that cool anymore and im not even played very much mobile game generally. Im could today use both Android and iOS as main phone (or even Windows Phone) if im wish.

So from today im will not or will not fix any issues with Android and iOS anymore, due im are quite tired against those platforms.

Im do still stay here. Windows is really all that fine and should focus on desktop again.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: Ian Price on 2018-Jan-13
I totally unerstand you here and agree. The mobile goalposts have just kept moving and devs are constantly having to play catch up, for very little reward (if any). The days of small indie devs making a big buck on any of the mobile stores is probably long gone.

Anyway, you've done a fantastic job of maintaining GLB and the mobile platforms for so long. Well done.

I'm glad that STEAM is working out for you and hopefully you will indeed stick around to help others with that.

Cheers :)
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-14
Thanks Ian.

Im did not feel I'm got a reward in the long run.

I'm did got a Apple TV,  which I'm still Surprised I'm got one so early and was pretty easy to port it. My iOS device account so first run out in about 8 month. The games lucky still running on iOS11.

I'm so still like that kind is market. ouya was also a very great console to test thing on.

Of course I'm will still help and I'm will not leave here. I'm just leave mobile platforms.  Currently I'm do have a eye on spectrum next.

Would been nice to see glbasic as a great language for a least those 3 major pc platforms (Windows,  Linux and Mac). Now it's great steam is more open than its was before, even it's have own issue.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-14
And I'm will still help gernot foe glbasic steam release. First time with focus on major desktop platforms only.

Just let me know,  I'm will help.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: mentalthink on 2018-Jan-14
SpaceFractal only give you thanks for all the work you did for GLbasic.

Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: bigsofty on 2018-Jan-15
I've dropped the mobile market too, I've 2 iPads and 1 iMac sitting in a cupboard. They still work great but Apple deemed them obsolete so I can't use them for development purposes anymore. This pissed me off now end, so I've given up trying to keep up with Apple trying to force new hardware into my home.

Steam may be a bit wild but it feels more "comfortable" with regards to allowing the developer to choose what platforms to support. This is somthing I can work with, so I'm aiming for a Steam release with my game.

All the same, thanks for all your work on the mobile side of things SF!  :booze:
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: Alex_R on 2018-Jan-16
Sad news, Spacefractal, but I understand your reasons. I thank you again your efforts to port IOS to 64 bits, so I could launch my last game. But as you say sales are too poor in mobile markets. It's a big effort without profit.

However I stil think that the power of GLBasic resides in its Multiplattform development. It is a pitty that mobile plattforms are falling right now. We need a miracle to change this!!  ;/

Btw: Good luck with Steam!!!
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: hardyx on 2018-Jan-16
Thank for you good job porting iOS to 64 bit and improve iOS and Android modules.
I hope you have good luck in Steam and keep contributing to GLB community.
:nw: :good:
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-16
Steam is "basically" a altermative Windows Store, but with a great userbase. So a glbasic release on steam, should get a least Windows as well Linux version working as the main focus. There is issues with the Linux version, but its howover only optional throught.

Im want to help if Gernot dedicate to release glbasic on steam. Just let me now. Im do thinks the main focus on first release would been desktop platforms.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: Schranz0r on 2018-Jan-16
Options:

- Steam
- Full open Source
- let it die, and don't give a *PIEP*

The Community was such a great one, nowadays the Community is dead...
A lot of people, like you spacefractal, put a lot of time into GLBasic to push it forward!
And now we let it die like this?  :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant:
That makes me sad...
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-17
As I'm wrote, I'm want happy to help a release on steam. They liked it when I'm wrote about it.

I'm have just focus on other thing now today. Currently glbasic do still works on current platform, but I'm want to take a break etc.

For me steam was the platform I'm got success on.

And I'm still monitor this forum yet, I'm leave iOS and Android by now, but I'm stay here.

I'm have even pulled my own apps out from Android, and also on iOS later this year.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: dreamerman on 2018-Jan-18
Sad :'( Thank You for your work on features for both mobile platforms, I just hope that if it would be needed someone will be able to pick where you finished (if possible). Mobile markets are different beast but can also give some $$, don't need extra stuff, just base GLB code working 100%.
Long live GLB! :-)
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: DaCarSoft on 2018-Jan-24
Hi Spacefractal.

Long time since I wrote here last time.

First of all: Thanks for all your efforts!!!! Thanks for your work... sincerely

I really feel the same, mobile platforms have become so complex, and there is no clear way to fix things in GLBasic. I really was bored because of problems under iOS and can't fix them, including the fact that I didn't knew of a unified and only place where to download all the fixes made by others members of this community, the latest versions of source files needed to continue fixing things, or the last complete GLBasic version including these fixes, to not try to reinvent the wheel.

I saw your comment about the ZX Spectrum Next, and I suggest, if you still don't know about it, to look also at the "ZX UNO", a project older than the Next and could also be the origin of the ZX Spectrum Next project idea...    in fact, Hark0 (TheHark0), member of this forum, is one of the members of the ZX UNO's team. (!!!!!)

Good luck with your projects!!!!!
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: erico on 2018-Jan-26
Hello Space,
yep I can understand the pain with mobiles.
Thanks for all the hard work you did.

Linux also needs update to 64b and OSx needs some command reworking.
We should have at least the main desktops working perfectly, but that is another subject.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-26
Should been possible with right compiler, due 64bit got pretty much fixed due iOS 64bit was (of course) forced.

Osx would also require 64bit soon I around this or next year. But actuelly its should been easiler and also should been a xcode project, just like iOS was really.

SteamOS does NOT currectly working with glbasic and something we should look why its wont. But this is howover not required either to put games on steam.

PS. Im have heard about ZX UNO, which does use a little bit different color ULA. Currectly im do want do something with Spectrum Next. Remember: Im did NEWER liked spectrum my self in the eailer day.... (mostly due im was a sound man, not a graphics man as such), a area C64 was much better than Spectrum. But..... im do really like Spectrum Next very much. Im wish im backed this one. Awesome limits.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-26
Om steam, I'm would focus on desktop stystems first for both 32 and 64bit.  Steam is not a mobile platforms
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: MrPlow on 2018-Jan-28
Fully understand where SF is coming from.... but for me it has been a different story...

Most of my success and revenue came from Android mobile and admob...so I hope to continue with that. I will still do PC steam releases too.

I have stuck with older Android Extra versions and that has worked out well for me. :)

GLB is still very capable of putting out great mobile games with a small footprints.

The system still runs fine for me for now...
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jan-28
yes im tried to fix admob, but impossible, due forcing move to Android Studio by Google..... its a bigger project as excepted.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jun-02
Ym have fixed a very few android issue, but im do still have to say:

Im have dedicated to leave the Mobilemarket and will also let my iOS Dev Account expire, which is somewhere in the Aug month. Im havent updated my games since iOS10, which they still working in iOS11. But you newer know about mobile market.

There is too many forcing tiresome updates and forcing too much thing.....

That include both iOS and Android.

But if there is small issues etc in Java, im do sure can fix it, but im will currectly not try to move the whole project to Android Studio. But with iOS, im do want to release the glbasic source code project im did. Because did WORKED with iOS11, just before im stopped (all required was to recompile the glbasic libs, so actuelly its was pretty simple). But im will not release it by my own and still want a permission from Gernot first.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: Ian Price on 2018-Jun-05
No point in worrting about iOS any more. Apple hve fixed that for you - https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/06/04/opengl-opencl-deprecated-in-favor-of-metal-2-in-macos-1014-mojave
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jun-06
Im have edited this a lots and just searched around. Here is what im have checked.

By now Apple have deprecated OpenGl, its very sad move. But when that is said, OpenGL will still been included in a least 10.14 and all tools using it is still included in xCode with both a least iOS12 and Mac 10.14. By now its only deprecated, but does not removing it.

Im just not hope they remove it completly, since its will breaks a LOTS of apps, and many will consider not develop to iOS and MacOS anymore, and they have been heavy critised about that, that even they do not have touched OpenGL in years.

Here is a nice article about OpenGL on Mac:
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-OpenGL-poorly-supported-on-Mac-OS-X

What about Vulcan?
If you ask me for the best general move for glbasic. We should add a VULCAN render support. VULCAN supports by all/most system, that include even systems like Nintendo Switch. VULCAN is not supported native by Apple, but exists a nice workarounds. So hence im would perfer move it to VULCAN for best multiplatform suppot.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jun-06
Also in the other side, Apple deprecated Carbon, back in 2012..... and its still works, but will howover soon remove after 10.14 throught (since no 32bit support). About 6-7 years after.

So there can still been some years, before its finally got removed (or by requirement), so there is no reason to not support it as long its works, despite deprecated.

MacOS10.14 is also the last 32bit support as well. here its a very diffrent issue. But iOS64 bit does work, so its should not really been a big issue (other we also need to move the project as a xCode project rather than using costume compilers).

Same with Android. SDK Manager got deprecated as well, but as im wrote we can relocate the path used by Android Studio and simply use from there.

Also we do use few deprecated features in glbasic, im still yet to get removed. One of them is in a Audio Driver file, that got deprecated since iOS8, but still works (me thinks). But im do have no clue what that function really does, if used at all.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: MrPlow on 2018-Jun-06
Also, in case you are interested on Android API-23 (manifest declaration)...

...my admob and inapp purchase features are all still working perfectly :)

 
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: spacefractal on 2018-Jun-06
Its might works when compiled with api23. But the java call back diddent work with Android 7.0 last time im checked. But should recheck again a day. But currectly all those requirements is a quite annoying.

But im do still recommend to by now recolate all paths to use that one used by Android Studio (both NDK and SDK). That should also means a much much smaller download for Android in the end.

For iOS and other systems (Windows include) in far future we move it to only supports Vulcan and OpenGL and not other closed source api (Vulcan CAN been used and remapped to Metal using a wrapper).

But again: iOS12 and MacOs 10.14 can still been supported, but its uncontain with the future after that. But its will not been removed in near future anyway, but more in far future.
Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: hardyx on 2018-Sep-10
Methal is the Apple's "DirectX", like Microsoft did some years ago deprecating OpenGL in Windows. In windows you don't have OpenGL, but the graphics card driver installs for you. Apple systems are a closed ecosystem, and they make all the hardware and the all the drivers. I think you can install OpenGL libraries when they remove them, but they are not in the system. Then your game or app must to install another package or request the user to install first.

Apple is not interested in OpenGL or OpenGL-ES, because the main responsible of OpenGL for Mac was assigned for improving Methal some years ago. Apple says that Methal improve the graphics performance and saves battery, because it's a modern and efficient API, but it's a library only for Apple hardware and it isn't available for other systems.

I think they don't remove OpenGL in next year, because many Steam and Appstore games are using, but they are saying "we can remove in any time, you are warned". Is like the "Rossetta" case, there was a transition period for old apps for some years, but they removed the support years later in Yosemite. They will remove from the system sooner or later.


Title: Re: Stopping iOS and Android support from me.
Post by: yoxola on 2018-Sep-11
When Apple removes OpenGL, I hope there're some wrapper available as a SDK or Library available.